Your Thoughts: Paladins and Utility Spells

Due to a discussion I am having elsewhere, I would like to know what you all think is appropriate use of a paladin’s utility spells, regardless of spec, over the course of a 4 hour raid night which is in Ruby Sanctum (25m regular) and ICC 25 (mostly heroic, some regular modes).

Please answer the following questions.

1) Should all paladins use Lay on Hands at some point in that 4-hour block?

2) Should all paladins know how to Cleanse? Should every paladin be expected to Cleanse? What encounters should they/shouldn’t they be expected to Cleanse on? What spec do you expect paladins who Cleanse to be?

3) Should all paladins use Hand of Salvation at some point in that 4-hour block? On whom? What spec should these casting paladins be? In what situations should it be cast?

4) Should all paladins use Hand of Sacrifice at some point in that 4-hour raid? On whom? What spec should they be? What situations?

5) Should all paladins use BOP (Hand of Protection) at some point in that raid? On whom? What spec should they be? In what situations would it be useful?

I await your answers and then will tell you on Tuesday why I’m asking. :)

19 Replies to “Your Thoughts: Paladins and Utility Spells”

  1. Hm.

    Okay, keep in mind, this is ME, little-level-60-never-raided that we’re talking about, but…

    1) I think so, but I think it probably depends on how things are going. If they’re going to use it on someone when there’s, like, 5 people left alive with 50% health left on the boss, that’s silly, but I think if they can get it off (most likely on themselves, if they’re not Holy) when it counts, especially if the whole raid is taking damage, that’s helpful.

    2) All Paladins should know how. If Prot has a spare second to cleanse themselves in a healing-intensive fight, I think they should. Same for Ret. Holy should obviously be cleansing anyway. I don’t know what on what fights, as I’m not knowledgeable enough to say, but there you have it.

    3) Hm… Well I’d say definitely Holy and Ret should be casting it on themselves if their threat is getting high. I don’t know if Prot would really have a chance to cast it on someone else, but if they notice a nearby DPS getting threat and they can manage it, I think they should, as long as this isn’t one of those “seriously, dude, START WATCHING YOUR AGGRO” guys, because if it is, that would probably only help for about 10 seconds, heh.

    4) I will decline to answer this question on the grounds that I’m still a little fuzzy on this one, having not really figured out how to use it yet. I’m working on it. >.>

    5) Yes. Obviously DON’T BOP THE TANK, which I accidentally did once. >.> Thankfully, everyone in that random was pretty laid-back and we all had a nice laugh, however…. don’t do it. I use it on myself, or, like, a mage who gets facesmasher aggro.

    THERE ARE MY TOTALLY UNHELPFUL ANSWERS. :D

  2. Okayyy.. let’s see :)

    1) Yes, definitely. Regardless of spec, role or what the hell they’re doing. I cannot stress this more. Any paladin has access to this awesome, instant-cast heal and it *should* be used. If not on others, then at least on yourself when you take significant damage. There is *always* a situation where it’s useful enough and it might save the raid. Well, unless you overgear everything and just steamroll through it all. But that’s not what I’m assuming here.

    2) Know how to Cleanse? Yes. But not every situation calls for cleansing and sometimes it’s just not necessary to expect of every paladin to cleanse when possible. Sometimes it’s fine to just let the healer handle it. There are exceptions, of course, but I’d definitely say that it’s not a requirement to do it, but it is to know how and know when it’s appropriate to Cleanse. No specifics, sorry.

    3) Heck, I don’t even use Hand of Salvation every raid night. I do personally believe that Retribution and Protection paladins should use Hand of Salvation when appropriate, on whomever is pulling high aggro. I think this task is easier for paladins who are (or should be) already actively watching threat. Retri paladins on themselves if needed. Protection paladins on others if needed. In addition, in a great blog post by BandageSpec, there was mention that any DPS should be watching their threat and call for a Salvation when needed, effectively increasing DPS by being able to keep doing awesome pewpew and not die by pulling aggro.

    4) I think it’s wrong to *expect* of all paladins to use Hand of Sacrifice at some point. I think that they could. For example, a Retribution paladin could decide that he needs to bubble at some point. He might as well use HoSac too on somebody who is also taking a lot of damage. I’m not sure about this, because I know nothing about tanking, but I think HoSac isn’t the right tool for the job when it comes to tanking. I think that, if you’re tanking, you’re already taking loads of damage and the last thing you need is taking even more damage. However, it may come in handy when there’s two tanks actively tanking stuff, or if the paladin isn’t the active tank. I just don’t know enough encounter specifics to name examples, sorry.

    5) BoP is definitely something any paladin could use, but not every paladin should by definition. It’s hard enough to spot when it’s a good time to use it, and if you’re not already watching the raid actively, it may be too distracting to go out of your way to BoP someone. That said, tanks and healers should definitely be expected to use BoP when appropriate. You might want to cast BoP on a DPS who’s pulling aggro when it’s already too late for a Salvation and the boss is coming for him/her. Usually the first hit is melee anyway, so BoP should handle that just fine.

    The one example I can come up with where every paladin should BoP, is Saurfang. I sometimes raid with as much as 3 paladins (in a 10 man) and I always try to coordinate use of BoP.

    I’ll add one of my own. I think that Retribution paladins should be expected to heal themselves with an instant FoL from the AoW proc when Exorcism is on cooldown. Of course, only when needed and only if the GCD can be missed. I think that DPS should always be able to use a GCD for some survivability instead of DPS (with some exceptions)..

  3. Perspective: holy/prot paladin alt, not very experienced on it.

    1) Should all paladins use Lay on Hands at some point in that 4-hour block?
    No. I usually save mine for oshit cases (boss is at 1%, the raid is dropping like flies, keeping someone alive for a bit longer might mean a kill). I forgot LoH anyway even in these cases.

    2) Should all paladins know how to Cleanse? Should every paladin be expected to Cleanse? What encounters should they/shouldn’t they be expected to Cleanse on? What spec do you expect paladins who Cleanse to be?
    Know – definitely. Have Decursive or something similar.
    Should – healers, definitely. Tanks and DPS, if there isn’t any healer to cleanse OR on encounters like Halion, when healers have a lot to do already.

    3) Should all paladins use Hand of Salvation at some point in that 4-hour block? On whom? What spec should these casting paladins be? In what situations should it be cast?
    Tanks – yes. On whichever DPS is trying to eat a boss cleave. Healers and DPS – if the tanks asks them to Salv someone or on themselves.

    4) Should all paladins use Hand of Sacrifice at some point in that 4-hour raid? On whom? What spec should they be? What situations?
    Uh. Maybe. Never used it, no idea exactly what it does. I guess all paladins should at least know what it does…

    5) Should all paladins use BOP (Hand of Protection) at some point in that raid? On whom? What spec should they be? In what situations would it be useful?
    Yes. I usually use it on myself (if I’m healing) or a healer in trouble (if I’m tanking), on stuff like Brohnjan (when he fears), the snakes guy in Gundrak or similar.

  4. 1) The unqualified answer is “no,” I would not necessarily expect that they would; however, all paladins should have it on their bars, be prepared to use it if necessary and if it becomes necessary, use it without hesitation or asking for permission. This all assumes the raid leader did not specify otherwise for any of those outcomes. If you’re a ret paladin, and a healer or dps dies and the raid wipes as a result of them dying – you could have avoided that. I wouldn’t expect a retadin’s LoH to be effective at keeping a tank alive where they might otherwise die, but who knows! Try it anyway.

    2) Yes. Yes. Yes, they should Cleanse on all of them except Halion (leave it to the pros) and unless otherwise directed to by the raid leader in general. I would expect all paladin specs to Cleanse.

    3) Yes. Ret paladins should use it on themselves to avoid gaining aggro as a first priority, and as a second priority, reserve it for the raider with the consistently highest aggro. This is all other paladin specs’ first priority (including holy paladins). As a healer, I abuse HoS to allow the highest threat-generating raid or party member to do more damage without risking themselves or others. Every paladin should have Omen and keep an eye on it whenever possible; obviously for retadins (and to a slightly lesser extent, protadins) this pretty much goes without saying.

    4) No. HoSac is a risky manuever and should only be used when combined with bubble as a tank mitigation cooldown or when specifically designated for use by the raid leader. Using HoSac in a dynamic situation where the current threats and mechanics are changing (for example, during Vile Spirits phase on Lich King) is asking for trouble.

    5) The unqualified answer is “no.” However, holy paladins should reserve it for specific fight mechanics (for example, Boiling Blood on Saurfang) or for melee dps who are having trouble controlling their threat (I think of it as “taking a chill pill”); protadins should reserve it for forcing a tank transition (that is, onto them: to force a transition onto the other tank a protadin should use bubble); and retadins should reserve it for use in response to specific fight mechanics in a manner similar to holy paladins. I would assume that all Holy Paladins would probably end up using BoP (or HoP if you prefer) at least once in a 4 hour period, and that likelihood then decreasing for each other spec in turn.

  5. Always an interesting topic to get others’ opinions on.

    1) LoH: Yes, I would say every pally should make an effort to use LoH during a raid. If they don’t play healers at all, then I probably wouldn’t expect it to be cast on anyone other than themselves, but it has such potential it should not be neglected.

    2) Cleanse: Yes, every paladin, regardless of spec, should be using cleanse. If you have enough other people in the raid that can remove all of those effects for you, then you can skip it. I expect Holy to cleanse more than any other as it’s their job to monitor those kinds of effects, followed by Ret and then Prot. In some fights, I expect Prot to be the top cleanser. Basically, every pally should be familiar with it and ready to cast it if needed, they just shouldn’t be the first and most responsible source of it unless other players don’t have the ability to remove the effects. If GCD’s have to be sacrificed because it’s needed so often, then DPS should be the ones to cover it before tanks and healers.

    3) HoSalv: If you have threat issues, then yes, you should probably have every pally using HoS on whoever needs it the most. In our case, it’s the friggin Demo lock that’s pulling 64k DPS on trash, though in all honesty he could have 24 pallies HoS him and he’s still pull agro. Prot and Ret are the ones I expect to use this, as Holy should rarely (if ever) have any reason to be watching threat meters.

    4) HoSac: I wouldn’t say every pally should be using it during the raid time, but it should definitely come up more than once (unless you’re steamrolling everything). HoSac is definitely situational, but it’s good in fights where damage mechanics change from raid heals to tank heals and back. When tanks are taking heavy damage, the other paladins in the group can use it to lessen that damage if your healers are needing some buffer room, similarly it can be used in those heavy raid damage situations to lessen the damage on critical members who are low or that may not survive it otherwise. It’s a great Hand spell to use in conjunction with LoH or with a bubble. Any spec could use it, but which one more often would depend on the encounter. In tank-swap fights Prot could use it well when not actively tanking, otherwise Ret would probably be the top user. I wouldn’t expect Holy to use it quite so much, though when used in addition to bubbles they’re just as good as any other.

    5) BoP: Again, situational. However, I’d say this one should come up even more than some of the others. For my guild, I don’t know how often it would really be useful since it seems that most non-tank deaths are caused by casters more than melee, so immunity to physical doesn’t help a whole lot. But take situations where mobs/bosses have a Cleave effect and you need to position them; if someone gets in the way or they have to be kited by moving through a non-tank, then you probably want to use it then. Prot will be more likely to use it on other players because they have the situational awareness of positioning more than other specs. Holy would be the second-most common caster for targeting other players who’re taking damage, where I would expect Ret to know how/when to cast it on themselves when trouble was on its way.

  6. 1) I would be of the opinion that they should. If someone in the raid has died from anything other than getting splattered by a single shot, that was a missed opportunity for a Holy Paladin to Lay on Hands. It is also great for topping off a very low tank, saving your healers tons of mana. Protection Paladins and Retribution Paladins should also use it to save themselves. Lay on Hands is one of those spells that Paladins are so eager to save “for emergencies,” they end up hardly ever using outside of PvP.

    2) All Paladins should know how to Cleanse, but I only expect Holy Paladins to cleanse anyone but themselves. Even Holy Paladins are relatively low on my list of cleansers. Since they are already struggling with a mobility deficiency and have their eyes glued to the tanks’ health bars, I leave most of the debuff removal to my raid healers. For example, I would have a Priest (Disc preferred) handle the disease on Rotface over a Holy Paladin; though I would consider having a Protection Ooze tank handle the Cleansing himself.

    3) Yes, they should all use it at least once regardless of spec. Holy Paladins should be using it on your top threat generators (likely a pesky Warlock or dps Warrior). Retribution Paladins should use it on themselves if they need it or send it to another dps if they don’t. Protection Paladins should also use it on themselves in tank-swapping fights like Festergut or Deathbringer so that they don’t need to kill their dps to fade aggro over to the other tank. Throttling back threat throttles up dps, so Hand of Salvation should not sit unused.

    4) Probably not, though most of the best Paladins will likely find a use for it. When paired with a bubble, it becomes a free cooldown for your tank on fights like Festergut. In the wrong hands though, this spell can simply leave your raid down a Paladin.

    5) No, I wouldn’t expect a Protection Paladin to use it every raid night. The other specs should likely use it however. Holy Paladins should use it to save other raiders (preferably healers) or to cover themselves when they would rather stand and turret than run to avoid a hazard. Retribution Paladins should use it to save their own skin.

  7. 1) Should all paladins use Lay on Hands at some point in that 4-hour block?

    I would say that it “should” be used once, more then likely in a 4 hr raid block. There will always be that “o crap” siutation that pops up now and then. And if taking down, rescueing VDW I would think LoH will be used at that time.

    2) Should all paladins know how to Cleanse? Should every paladin be expected to Cleanse? What encounters should they/shouldn’t they be expected to Cleanse on? What spec do you expect paladins who Cleanse to be?

    I would say..if you can cleanse/dispel/ etc I would think you should help if possible.
    Encounters I would say let the paladins should not be expected are fights where they cannot spare a GCD – Heroic Saurfang, VDW, Lich King. (as Holy)
    Prot and Ret…I can see cleasing at will.

    3) Should all paladins use Hand of Salvation at some point in that 4-hour block? On whom? What spec should these casting paladins be? In what situations should it be cast?

    I would expect a Hand of Salv to be used at least some point. I would say on jobs that generate lots of threat – locks, fury warriors, and sometimes ret paladins. I would say any spec should be expected to help out. Any spec should be able to see threat generated and use as approp.

    4) Should all paladins use Hand of Sacrifice at some point in that 4-hour raid? On whom? What spec should they be? What situations?

    Again depends. You can find yourself eating the floor if not careful. This plus, aura mastery, and bubble can be useful when festergut expells the gas.

    5) Should all paladins use BOP (Hand of Protection) at some point in that raid? On whom? What spec should they be? In what situations would it be useful?

    Holy Paladins yes to save themselves or others. Ret it depends…prob to save their own skin.
    Festergut expelling gas I can see this as useful, or perhaps when oozes explode in Rotface.

  8. (My perspective, mind you, is from being MS Ret/OS Holy)

    1. That’s situation-dependent, I think. For anyone other than a Holydin using LoH, vocal coordination may be ideal, depending on cooldowns other people are using. OTOH, one shouldn’t forget it’s there either, nor be afraid to use it. I use it fairly regularly on my Retadin.

    2. Cleansing, oh how I love to cleanse! There are some situations (Halion) where cleansing others would be best left to ‘the experts’ as someone else said, but in cases where I can cleanse myself rather than needing another healer to do so, I do.

    3-5. I am a fail pally with my hand spells :(
    This is a bad excuse but I’ve never had a good hotkey spot for them, so they’ve never quite gotten the use they should. That said, yes I think any pally chould use them if the situation warrants it.

  9. I can only come at this from a Tankadin stance (As that is what I am):

    1) I expect holy paladins to use it regularly. I expect prot to use it as a defensive CD when they know they are going to get whuped on. I expect Retadins to use it close to how prot does. I think that ANYONE who see a good use of it should instantly do so, however, I don’t want prot and ret to be focusing on life bars, that really is a healer’s job. Prot at least should be looking at raid frames for agro and what not, but in boss fights, they will mostly just be watching the encounter.

    2) As a healer, I think everyone is responsible for dispels. I expect healers to be at the front of the line, they should be paying attention, but I think that all players should have a click casting frame with the debuffs they can dispel showing up. Again, as with LoH, healers should be focusing on raid health, however, when a fight calls for dispelling as a key mechanic, everyone should know and should be up for it.

    3) HoSal is a tankadin thing to me. You know how is on your watch list for threat, and should hoS them when needed, however, my only place I use it regularly is any tank switch. If I know that either my self or the other tank is going to be close on threat I will HoS as needed. This is a big one on Festergut obviously, as you know, having a tank blow up is bad, mmkay (had that happen for the first time last night, it was rather hilarious, specially as we still won :P).

    4) HoSac is an interesting one. It’s a great tool, and I honestly only ever use it when I’m tanking something that will not be hitting me that hard, or in cases like Bonestorm, though I tend to just DP/DS durign bonestorm if I’m confidant that I’m not going to need DP as an actual cooldown. I would think it would only be something I would use as a strategy for a specific fight so that healers KNOW the extra damage is coming, and I can’t think of any good specific examples (outside of Saurfang).

    5) BoP is in the same boat as HoSac as far as I care. It’s something that should be planed ahead, and Saurfang is the only case I can think of using it :P (and that’s b/c you said to)

  10. I started coming at these questions from a very Holy-centric point of view at first (because for Holy, the answer to all those questions would be YES, USE THEM ALL! :p), but I don’t think most of those things really are all that necessary for Prot/Ret. There are fights where some of those skills are nearly necessary, but not always. I remember having to really lay into our Prot tank during Iron Council-25 hardmode to Cleanse herself of the punch debuff because I didn’t have time. But there really aren’t any fights in ICC like that. Maybe LK? I would say that all three specs should be used to using Salv, though. Of the support abilities, I’d say that’s the only one I’d really need to see being using throughout the night by Prot and Ret.

  11. Addendum: I don’t think Prot/Ret should really use either LoH or BoP on themselves, seeing as doing so would cause Forbearance and interfere with their useful abilities. For example, a Prot tank would be far better off popping “bubble shield wall” than using LoH. -If- they sometime get the chance to use it on someone else, that’s fine, but I would never expect it of them. Ditto Ret.

  12. From a class standpoint, much like Codi, my default reaction is ZOMG YES. This is mainly because I hold the argument that paladins are a utility based class—a lot of our flair comes from knowing when to use the right buttons to help the raid, but this is not as obvious as, say, what Shamans bring with their big glowy totems. This was reinforced as a concept with Hand Spells not locking out a Blessing. Otherwise, we are really just a class with three heals and a couple buttons to push.

    As such, I am going to address these things from each spec.
    1) Holy— we’re talented into damage reduction via talents and should use the cooldown when needed. As all things go, this is excellent when planned, but LoH is ultimately a tool we fall upon if the shit hits the fan while moving. It is awesome via beacon.

    Prot – Yes, this is a tanking cooldown. Is Divine Protection on cooldown? Are you dangerously low? Hello Hands.

    Ret – I do not expect rets to use Loh, but man it helps out when they do. A proper ret paladin should toss it on a healer or tank when things get hairy. It is just one GCD.

    2) Yes. Yes, a thousand times yes. So useful in PvP and PvE, and it saves your healers a few seconds to heal. This talent is extremely helpful when your prot paladin can cleanse on Rotface or back at the Iron Council. This ability is gained at level 40 and should have been used while levelling—there are many magic effects that other healers cannot cleanse. I frown when a prot paladin forgets to cleanse himself while on my druid.

    All specs: use it.

    3) Holy – to be used liberally.

    Prot – this tool is really for you. I think that Prot Paladins have the best judgement with this spell and should have it bound handily.

    Ret – Eh, I do not except a ret paladin to rock out Salvation except on themselves if needed.

    4) I’m Holy and I often forget to use Hand of Sacrifice. Do I use it on pulls? All the time. Often times I’m more concerned with Holy Lighting than using it when not planned ahead, but the damage portion is usually too much of a liability.

    Prot – I’ve seen a lot of offtanks use Hand of Sacrifice and it makes sense — this is a mini Pain Suppression and they often have the health to eat the damage. I expect a protection paladin to know what this button does and use it to help his party / raid.

    Ret – I do not really expect Ret paladins to worry about this one at all. I suppose that I’m always pleasantly surprised when a dps remembers that they have other abilities than ZOMG PEW PEW.

    5) Only on specific encounters when planned ahead. BoP is one of those spells that is not usually needed on a boss fight. I except each paladin to know what the spell does and have it handy if they see the opportunity to us it, however. I probably expect Holy and Prot and use it more than a DPS.

    Too long to read: If you are outstanding, you will use the tools you are given and understand how they work. It is a mark of skill to effectively use your utility spells (and this can be applied to every class).

  13. Yay! A quiz! Keep in mind that my Paladin is my alt and I mostly heal as a Disc Priest in guild runs. My Paladin pugs a lot so I get to see all kinds of healers from the awesome to the epic fail ones on a regular basis. (I encountered a Holy Pally the other day with around 300 haste and 63 points in the Holy tree to give you any idea…)

    1) I find myself using Lay on Hands at the tank swap on Festergut fairly often, especially in 25 mans. I really can’t think of any other situation when I would use it other than a truly oh shit moment – maybe the middle section of trash got pulled on the way to Marrowgar or some other random thing you don’t expect. The way I see it is that I have spec’d and glyphed to have a reduced CD, why not use it? I used to have a problem with never using Pain Suppression on my Priest and save it on “what ifs”. But then I would fly back to my body thinking that, damn I should have used it so now I blow it all the time. LoH is kinda the same way – it is there for a reason. I also think Ret and Prot should know when to use it. They should have some situational awareness and be proactive in the event healers are down or otherwise incapacitated.

    2) All Paladins should cleanse – no excuses. I shouldn’t have to ask for a cleanse when I get turned into a green slime. Cleansing is my absolute pet peeve in the whole game. Anyone who can cleanse should, regardless of if they are a Paladin, Priest, Druid or whatever. On fights like Rotface and Lich King there should be an assigned person to cleanse due to fight mechanics so people aren’t flailing around with slimes in the raid or the disease stacks fall off the adds. Everyone should know who this person is in case something happens and they can’t cleanse. It is so refreshing to me to be in a raid with other people helping on the cleansing. It always seems like I am the only one that cleanses on a regular basis. I have been known to shift out of bear form and cleanse curses and poisons if it’s safe to do so.

    3) I confess I don’t really use Hand of Salvation. I close out my omen in raids if I’m not tanking. I have too much happening already to watch Omen on top of everything else. I am not going to take precious seconds of not casting to find the retard DPS who can’t or won’t control their aggro. The only way I would use it is if a tank swap goes bad because the first tank is carrying too much aggro and pulls off the second tank without meaning to.

    4) I don’t use Hand of Sacrifice, either. I’m a little too chicken to try it. But my fiancée swears by it. He loves the whole “Bubble Sac” thing.

    5) All that being said, I do use BOP. If I see a healer being eaten alive from an add, I’ll BOP them. I save it for healers (or myself) in raids. (Kinda off topic but… The same animation as BOP is used when the proc from the Ashen Band of Endless Courage happens. I absolutely panicked the first time I saw it go off when I was bear tanking. I was like… what? There’s no Paladin here! Oh wait…)

  14. 1) Only if Dreamwalker is in that 4 hour block.

    2) All of them should know how to. Only tanks should be expected to regularly cleanse themselves or specific targets, such as infections on Rotface. If you don’t have a paladin tank then ret should be expected to cleanse in certain encounters such as Steelbreaker’s Fusion Punch.

    3) Salvation should not be a regular cast except for particular fights or compositions where threat capping is a big problem. At that point all paladins should know how to cast it.

    4) HoSac should not be absolutely necessary, but all paladins of every spec should know how to cast it. Usage by non-Holy specs should be planned in detail for certain fight mechanics, such as rotations for Festergut with 3 inhales or Baltharus at >25 stacks.

    5) Aside from certain fights like Saurfang, all paladins should know how to use BoP as a ‘just in case’ effect. Best usage is to save a caster with aggro. Second best usage is to save an over eager melee dps from aggro. I understand it is also useful for ret paladins to pull ahead of warrior dps. Third best usage is to force a tank swap.

  15. Slightly off topic, but all paladins who have Divine Sacrifice/Guardian should not be afraid to use it without their bubble. Since the nerf the damage transfer is relatively low in most cases.

  16. 1) Should all paladins use Lay on Hands at some point in that 4-hour block?

    Yes. And I would be surprised if there wasn’t an occasion for it to be used multiple times in those 4 hours from all paladins, regardless of class. I frequently keep mine on cooldown on Dannie. They timer on it is so short now, that there is generally one point in an encounter that I have found it useful.

    2) Should all paladins know how to Cleanse? Should every paladin be expected to Cleanse? What encounters should they/shouldn’t they be expected to Cleanse on? What spec do you expect paladins who Cleanse to be?

    All paladins should know how to cleanse. I think I would probably prioritize cleansing priorities Holy -> Ret -> Prot. But I certainly think that Ret and Prot paladins should cleanse if there is something in need of cleansing and no one else is doing it…especially if it’s a debuff on themselves.

    3) Should all paladins use Hand of Salvation at some point in that 4-hour block? On whom? What spec should these casting paladins be? In what situations should it be cast?

    Yes, all paladins should use Hand of Salvation multiple times in a 4 hour raid block. They should all have a threat meter up and running. They should prioritize Salv on classes that do not have a significant agro drop, such as moonkin, dps warriors and to a less extent dps shaman. If none of those classes are in need of a salv, hit whoever is pushing the tank. If it’s not needed, hold it. However because it’s a relatively short cooldown, if it would be of use no reason to hold back.

    Our prot paladin has our fury warrior macro’d for his salv.

    4) Should all paladins use Hand of Sacrifice at some point in that 4-hour raid? On whom? What spec should they be? What situations?

    I will admit that of the damage reduction tools that I have, this is one that I use the least, and frequently do not make use of during raids. It was useful for some encounters in Ulduar – and probably holds some use in ICC.

    I’m not entirely certain on if Prot or Ret paladins find it any more useful – or like me, tend to not make much use of it.

    I know that I tend to use other damage reducers first…and have killed myself with this ability =)

    5) Should all paladins use BOP (Hand of Protection) at some point in that raid? On whom? What spec should they be? In what situations would it be useful?

    Yes, all paladins should utilize BoP in a raid, regardless of Spec. One of our Holy Paladins has a macro for me because I tend to pull mountains of heal agro on trash.

    BoP is situationally useful in encounters, but we find it very helpful for P1 LK for someone who has pulled threat on the ghouls. There is likely always an instance that BoP would be useful during trash.

  17. I’m clearly late to the party, but I wanted to join in. I thought the responses were very interesting. And I still don’t have a max level Pally, so my perspective might be skewed, but here goes… While a lot of my perspective comes from playing other classes, it’s my firm belief that excellence in playing comes from using utility well as you are maximizing your role.

    1) Should all paladins use Lay on Hands at some point in that 4-hour block?
    Well if you are facerolling content where no one dies, maybe not. But I can’t recall a night in ICC where this wasn’t at least situationally useful in four hours if not on cooldown – for any spec. For healers this is a no brainer – healing is your priority. For tanks? It’s a great cooldown if things go wrong. For Ret? Yeah, I know healing isn’t your thing…but do some healing on yourself when things go wrong and you might die…or toss it on a tank or healer in a pinch. Those situations are often called out in vent and don’t require keeping your eyes on the health bars at all times to figure out.

    2) Should all paladins know how to Cleanse? Should every paladin be expected to Cleanse? What encounters should they/shouldn’t they be expected to Cleanse on? What spec do you expect paladins who Cleanse to be?
    If you are raiding and you don’t know how to effectively see or dispel clensable effects you are doing it wrong. Sure, I’d expect a Healadin to get to it first most of the time (if another healing class wasn’t getting to it.) I expect a Retadin to cleanse himself and back up cleansing the raid for utility. I expect tanks have Better Things To Do, but are at least able to pick it up if the class make up isn’t working or if it just needs to be done. I distinctly recall an evening in Nax where we were short on dispellers and it took fifteen minutes to talk our Enhance Shaman through *how* to do it and he still pretty much failed. Seriously. Learn to play your class. I don’t expect a Prot or Ret Pally to be staring at debufs all night…but I do expect them to pick it up when needed without issue.

    3) Should all paladins use Hand of Salvation at some point in that 4-hour block? On whom? What spec should these casting paladins be? In what situations should it be cast?
    Yes. I’m a bit stunned to read the responses and see so many people thinking tanks have better things to do. Isn’t maintaining threat a tank thing? Ret Pallies should also be aware of threat, and toss this on themselves and/or other dps when needed. Be a team player. I have to admit I don’t expect Healadins to be paying attention to Omen, or even have it up. I do expect that if called out for, they could use it, and in a four hour raid I’d expect that would happen.

    4) Should all paladins use Hand of Sacrifice at some point in that 4-hour raid? On whom? What spec should they be? What situations?
    Yeah, this is situational. There’s a risk in using it and it can depend on whether you have a cooldown to back it up or whether you communicate with your healers.

    5) Should all paladins use BOP (Hand of Protection) at some point in that raid? On whom? What spec should they be? In what situations would it be useful?
    Obviously, this is nifty on Saurfang…but I have trouble imagining that it isn’t useful otherwise as well.

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